Cancel Culture
Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-02-22 10:59 PM (#775289)
Subject: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
The cancel culture is actually sponsors and advertisers who decide who get banned from networks. Politically correctness... It’s all about the money and advertising... end of story! Entertainers have been getting canceled since the birth of radio and TV.

But then, with in the fabric of truth, it’s funny how the privileged, all of sudden are blaming everything on “cancel culture” like it’s new and they discovered the term! When in actuality, they created it hundreds of years ago, by canceling a whole gender from the culture. Woman couldn’t vote, run for office, work for over a 100 years.

Then the privileged culture, not so long ago, cancelled people of color from, eating where they eat, equal education, voting! working where they work. People of color couldn’t compete in the same leagues and sports teams, For years they were cancelled from being on TV shows and Movies.

There were dozens of golf courses where Tiger Woods was the first man of color to play in. But now that the tables are turned and openly racist and sexist and bigots are being cancelled from social media and from the entertainment world, they’re crying like baby’s! Like Little bitches!

There was a reason why the KKK wore hoods, because they knew the consequences for their actions were growing! Put your hoods back on and go back to your back forest shacks!

Edited by Andy Bathgate 2021-02-22 11:14 PM
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-02-26 6:01 PM (#775424 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
This may very well be the most IDIOTIC statement I've seen on OTG.
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PV29
Posted 2021-03-05 11:13 AM (#775851 - in reply to #775424)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 2326
1000
So according to what I'm reading at the top, injustices and violations of rights occurring now are ok because there were injustices and violations of rights in the past. Wow.

Not only is that take twisted and inconsistent with a civilized society, it's factually incorrect.

The cancel culture we see now has nothing to do with race, gender or other identity group. It's about speech and thought that doesn't comply with the "acceptable" narrative of Leftist corporate media, Hollywood and big tech. If you question the election results by pointing out statistical anomalies or unconstitutional rule changes in certain states you get kicked off of social media, fired from your job and targeted by Leftists in Congress. Example: letter sent by two House members to cable/satellite TV providers questioning why they are still carrying Fox, OANN and Newsmax. That had nothing to do with race or gender, and everything to do with thought and free expression of ideas.

Why did Amazon, in coordination with Google and Apple, attack and de-platform a social media company (Parler)?
Why did Twitter ban the NY Post for reporting on Hunter Biden?
Why was a soccer player (Seth Jahn) removed from the U.S. Soccer Federation’s Athlete Council for expressing an opinion about standing for the anthem?

Cancel culture is thought and speech tyranny. Leftists have learned that the 1st Amendment only prohibits government action which infringes free speech. And they're using private companies to accomplish what they can't do through government action.

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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-05 12:19 PM (#775853 - in reply to #775851)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
PV29 - 2021-03-05 1:13 PM

So according to what I'm reading at the top, injustices and violations of rights occurring now are ok because there were injustices and violations of rights in the past. Wow.

Not only is that take twisted and inconsistent with a civilized society, it's factually incorrect.

The cancel culture we see now has nothing to do with race, gender or other identity group. It's about speech and thought that doesn't comply with the "acceptable" narrative of Leftist corporate media, Hollywood and big tech. If you question the election results by pointing out statistical anomalies or unconstitutional rule changes in certain states you get kicked off of social media, fired from your job and targeted by Leftists in Congress. Example: letter sent by two House members to cable/satellite TV providers questioning why they are still carrying Fox, OANN and Newsmax. That had nothing to do with race or gender, and everything to do with thought and free expression of ideas.

Why did Amazon, in coordination with Google and Apple, attack and de-platform a social media company (Parler)?
Why did Twitter ban the NY Post for reporting on Hunter Biden?
Why was a soccer player (Seth Jahn) removed from the U.S. Soccer Federation’s Athlete Council for expressing an opinion about standing for the anthem?

Cancel culture is thought and speech tyranny. Leftists have learned that the 1st Amendment only prohibits government action which infringes free speech. And they're using private companies to accomplish what they can't do through government action.



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Fish
Posted 2021-03-05 12:31 PM (#775854 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture



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Posts: 4505
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Location: USA
I think that the term "Cancel Culture" has been applied pretty broadly, or narrowly, depending on who is delivering the message.

For me, the definition can be summed up as: a politically motivated group, organization or individual who seeks to use social pressure to isolate or neutralize the opinions of a group, organization, business or individual.

In the examples you give, I see in the first two examples, choices made by corporations as to what they think will be the least damaging to them on a bottom line. In the Amazon example, Parler running on Amazon was probably not widely known before Parler became a more prominent part of the conversation. When some of the content that was being shared and posted on Parler became known, and that it was being hosted on Amazon, then they had a choice...they could either deal with potential backlash from those who found the material objectionable, or the backlash from taking down a platform that many conservatives were now using for social media. They gave Parler the opportunity to deal with the objectionable material, and Parler declined to implement it, so Amazon made the decision to shut them off.

You could argue it was those who went crawling through Parler looking for the material were bent on shutting down the site, and they did everything they could do generate social pressure, which in turn influences Amazon's decision - and that would be Cancel Culture as I see it, but Amazon I don't see as part of that per se. If the pressure didn't exist, Parler would probably be still there.

On the Twitter example, I think that one is more related to the specific content. If you look at the timeline for that story, it was first brought to the Wall Street Journal, who after doing their own work, decided that the information wasn't credible enough to publish, and as such they didn't. The story then went to the New York Post, where the byline - that is to say who the story was credited to was Emma-Jo Morris a deputy politics editor who just joined the Post, and Gabrielle Fonrouge, who reportedly had little to do with the article. Bruce Golding who apparently did contribute to it, did not wish his byline to be used because he felt like much of it wasn't credible. If you also consider that Rudy Giulinani - Trump's personal attorney - is the one that brought it to the Post, and had a vested interest in causing damage to a political rival, then I think there's good reason to be cautious about it.

The challenge comes down to determining when something is untrue, and what sort of damage that might do to individuals, institutions or the nation. Libel and Slander laws are not sufficient, nor is the court system efficient enough to deal with these things. In history, you've seen where lies have been used to "cancel" or indeed kill people. The two best examples in US History would be the Salem witch trials, and the McCarthy era purges, where being accused of being a witch or a communist sympathizer basically tarnished, or even condemned that individual before they had a fair trial.

When faced with promoting something that is quite questionable, or very suspect, I think social media companies are faced with a challenge...when is it okay to publish these things, and when is it not. I think they've made plenty of mistakes trying to be too lenient and seen things like Qanon flare up, and so they've overreacted in some instances the other way.

I myself don't know what the answer is. I got interested in Qanon from a "where did it come from" and "what do followers believe" and was really quite amazed at how the whole thing operates. It's an alternate reality that seems like no regular person would believe in, but then again there are wide range of people that do indeed believe it.

When someone in the public eye or a leader gives credence to it, even tacitly, then that can have far ranging impact on those individuals as well as those who may be impacted by their actions.

Nazism and Fascism in some sense were similar more politically motivated incidents of this behavior, as is what has transgressed in places like Venezeula, where a small group uses those actions to manipulate the country as a whole to do things they otherwise wouldn't do.

I'm not for cancelling out voices, but I do have concern about those who tell lies and from positions of authority, and I think there will always be reactions to things that are socially questionable. Personally I'd like to see more voices heard, and I'd like it to be less about preventing and more about creating...but that's a pipe dream.

When a party like the Democratic party helps engineer Hillary Clinton's candidacy in 2016, or when Donald Trump threatens to crush all those who disagree with him, it makes people disaffected, and in some cases, can enable more extreme behavior.

For me Cancel Culture is part of a broader issue of attacking those you disagree with, and that is something that is far more prevalent than just liberal activists suppressing conservative voices.
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PV29
Posted 2021-03-05 6:42 PM (#775865 - in reply to #775854)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 2326
1000
I disagree that Amazon ejected Parler for business reasons. there is plenty of objectionable material that is currently hosted on AWS. And there is a serious debate about what "chances" Amazon gave Parler to remove certain material. The mullahs of Iran post "death to America" on Twitter and that's seemingly OK. But post about the election being less than fair and they target you for censorship and cancellation.

As the for the Post story about Hunter's laptop, it's very convenient that the FBI confirmed AFTER the election that an investigation into Hunter's tax returns is ongoing. Twitter had no problem allowing posts about portions of Trump's tax returns that were leaked. Disclosing federal tax returns without consent is a federal crime, yet they never blocked or suspended anyone who posted those leaked returns. Their faux pearl clutching over whether the material about Hunter was "reliable" is laughable. The story was corroborated by a former business partner of Hunter who provided further documents and gave TV interviews. Twitter had no problem in 2015 and 2016 allowing posts by/about Avenatti and his clients and their claims against Trump (Stormy Daniels). But that's because it was potentially damaging to the candidate they hated.

Social media has the protections of Section 230, so they have NO liability for libel or slander. There is no reasoning for this fear as the motivation for censorship.

The decision about whether something is credible and not "disinformation" is up to each of us. It is our right, and our duty as citizens, to hear and read as much as we can and make up our own minds as to what we believe. We don't want or need big tech overlords telling us what is "safe" to read and see. The free exchange of ideas and information is the cornerstone of our society. Offensive speech is protected from censorship by the government because the proper response to false and offensive speech is MORE speech which opposes and challenges it.

I'll end with this: When big tech companies and corporations like Amazon start censoring and canceling voices at the behest of politicians and political parties (see as an example, AOC and Michele Obama calling for Trump's ban from Twitter) then these companies are acting as de facto government entities. They should therefore be prohibited by the 1st Amendment from infringing upon free speech. Look to the near future for lawsuits that will allege this and challenge the idea that Twitter, Facebook, etc., are private companies that can censor as they see fit.
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PV29
Posted 2021-03-05 6:44 PM (#775866 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 2326
1000
By the way, it's refreshing to be able to debate these things without insults and ad hominen attacks. Cheers!
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-05 7:04 PM (#775867 - in reply to #775865)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
PV29 - 2021-03-05 8:42 PM

I disagree that Amazon ejected Parler for business reasons. there is plenty of objectionable material that is currently hosted on AWS. And there is a serious debate about what "chances" Amazon gave Parler to remove certain material. The mullahs of Iran post "death to America" on Twitter and that's seemingly OK. But post about the election being less than fair and they target you for censorship and cancellation.

As the for the Post story about Hunter's laptop, it's very convenient that the FBI confirmed AFTER the election that an investigation into Hunter's tax returns is ongoing. Twitter had no problem allowing posts about portions of Trump's tax returns that were leaked. Disclosing federal tax returns without consent is a federal crime, yet they never blocked or suspended anyone who posted those leaked returns. Their faux pearl clutching over whether the material about Hunter was "reliable" is laughable. The story was corroborated by a former business partner of Hunter who provided further documents and gave TV interviews. Twitter had no problem in 2015 and 2016 allowing posts by/about Avenatti and his clients and their claims against Trump (Stormy Daniels). But that's because it was potentially damaging to the candidate they hated.

Social media has the protections of Section 230, so they have NO liability for libel or slander. There is no reasoning for this fear as the motivation for censorship.

The decision about whether something is credible and not "disinformation" is up to each of us. It is our right, and our duty as citizens, to hear and read as much as we can and make up our own minds as to what we believe. We don't want or need big tech overlords telling us what is "safe" to read and see. The free exchange of ideas and information is the cornerstone of our society. Offensive speech is protected from censorship by the government because the proper response to false and offensive speech is MORE speech which opposes and challenges it.

I'll end with this: When big tech companies and corporations like Amazon start censoring and canceling voices at the behest of politicians and political parties (see as an example, AOC and Michele Obama calling for Trump's ban from Twitter) then these companies are acting as de facto government entities. They should therefore be prohibited by the 1st Amendment from infringing upon free speech. Look to the near future for lawsuits that will allege this and challenge the idea that Twitter, Facebook, etc., are private companies that can censor as they see fit.


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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-05 7:05 PM (#775868 - in reply to #775866)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
PV29 - 2021-03-05 8:44 PM

By the way, it's refreshing to be able to debate these things without insults and ad hominen attacks. Cheers!




I completely agree.
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-05 7:09 PM (#775869 - in reply to #775854)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
Fish - 2021-03-05 2:31 PM

I think that the term "Cancel Culture" has been applied pretty broadly, or narrowly, depending on who is delivering the message.

For me, the definition can be summed up as: a politically motivated group, organization or individual who seeks to use social pressure to isolate or neutralize the opinions of a group, organization, business or individual.

In the examples you give, I see in the first two examples, choices made by corporations as to what they think will be the least damaging to them on a bottom line. In the Amazon example, Parler running on Amazon was probably not widely known before Parler became a more prominent part of the conversation. When some of the content that was being shared and posted on Parler became known, and that it was being hosted on Amazon, then they had a choice...they could either deal with potential backlash from those who found the material objectionable, or the backlash from taking down a platform that many conservatives were now using for social media. They gave Parler the opportunity to deal with the objectionable material, and Parler declined to implement it, so Amazon made the decision to shut them off.

You could argue it was those who went crawling through Parler looking for the material were bent on shutting down the site, and they did everything they could do generate social pressure, which in turn influences Amazon's decision - and that would be Cancel Culture as I see it, but Amazon I don't see as part of that per se. If the pressure didn't exist, Parler would probably be still there.

On the Twitter example, I think that one is more related to the specific content. If you look at the timeline for that story, it was first brought to the Wall Street Journal, who after doing their own work, decided that the information wasn't credible enough to publish, and as such they didn't. The story then went to the New York Post, where the byline - that is to say who the story was credited to was Emma-Jo Morris a deputy politics editor who just joined the Post, and Gabrielle Fonrouge, who reportedly had little to do with the article. Bruce Golding who apparently did contribute to it, did not wish his byline to be used because he felt like much of it wasn't credible. If you also consider that Rudy Giulinani - Trump's personal attorney - is the one that brought it to the Post, and had a vested interest in causing damage to a political rival, then I think there's good reason to be cautious about it.

The challenge comes down to determining when something is untrue, and what sort of damage that might do to individuals, institutions or the nation. Libel and Slander laws are not sufficient, nor is the court system efficient enough to deal with these things. In history, you've seen where lies have been used to "cancel" or indeed kill people. The two best examples in US History would be the Salem witch trials, and the McCarthy era purges, where being accused of being a witch or a communist sympathizer basically tarnished, or even condemned that individual before they had a fair trial.

When faced with promoting something that is quite questionable, or very suspect, I think social media companies are faced with a challenge...when is it okay to publish these things, and when is it not. I think they've made plenty of mistakes trying to be too lenient and seen things like Qanon flare up, and so they've overreacted in some instances the other way.

I myself don't know what the answer is. I got interested in Qanon from a "where did it come from" and "what do followers believe" and was really quite amazed at how the whole thing operates. It's an alternate reality that seems like no regular person would believe in, but then again there are wide range of people that do indeed believe it.

When someone in the public eye or a leader gives credence to it, even tacitly, then that can have far ranging impact on those individuals as well as those who may be impacted by their actions.

Nazism and Fascism in some sense were similar more politically motivated incidents of this behavior, as is what has transgressed in places like Venezeula, where a small group uses those actions to manipulate the country as a whole to do things they otherwise wouldn't do.

I'm not for cancelling out voices, but I do have concern about those who tell lies and from positions of authority, and I think there will always be reactions to things that are socially questionable. Personally I'd like to see more voices heard, and I'd like it to be less about preventing and more about creating...but that's a pipe dream.

When a party like the Democratic party helps engineer Hillary Clinton's candidacy in 2016, or when Donald Trump threatens to crush all those who disagree with him, it makes people disaffected, and in some cases, can enable more extreme behavior.

For me Cancel Culture is part of a broader issue of attacking those you disagree with, and that is something that is far more prevalent than just liberal activists suppressing conservative voices.


I appreciate your view and opinion about this subject. I appreciate the fact that it appears that you think for yourself, and aren't swayed by a biased liberal media!
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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-05 9:17 PM (#775873 - in reply to #775851)
Subject: Re: Cancel Cult





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
PV29 - 2021-03-05 1:13 PM

So according to what I'm reading at the top, injustices and violations of rights occurring now are ok because there were injustices and violations of rights in the past. Wow.

Not only is that take twisted and inconsistent with a civilized society, it's factually incorrect.

The cancel culture we see now has nothing to do with race, gender or other identity group. It's about speech and thought that doesn't comply with the "acceptable" narrative of Leftist corporate media, Hollywood and big tech. If you question the election results by pointing out statistical anomalies or unconstitutional rule changes in certain states you get kicked off of social media, fired from your job and targeted by Leftists in Congress. Example: letter sent by two House members to cable/satellite TV providers questioning why they are still carrying Fox, OANN and Newsmax. That had nothing to do with race or gender, and everything to do with thought and free expression of ideas.

Why did Amazon, in coordination with Google and Apple, attack and de-platform a social media company (Parler)?
Why did Twitter ban the NY Post for reporting on Hunter Biden?
Why was a soccer player (Seth Jahn) removed from the U.S. Soccer Federation’s Athlete Council for expressing an opinion about standing for the anthem?

Cancel culture is thought and speech tyranny. Leftists have learned that the 1st Amendment only prohibits government action which infringes free speech. And they're using private companies to accomplish what they can't do through government action.



That’s funny, Democrats have been canceled also... Chris Matthews on MSNBC, cancelled for saying something not politically correct, Bill Mahr was cancelled, Al Franken cancelled... Tiki Barber Canceled... Colin Kaepernick, canceled! ... over the last 20 years 100’s of people in politics and the entertainment world have been cancelled for saying stupid crap... do I agree with it no! But to pretend it’s anything new and to victimize yourself is a freakin joke... there’s a list of tens of thousands of people since the 1920s that have been fired for saying politically incorrect stuff as politicians or entertainers! Give me a Republican or white person being fired-or cancelled and I can give you a lefty who has been also. So stop with this victimization crap already! Disconnect from the FOX radicalization.

Speech Tyranny? LOL! Who’s been arrested ? Advertisers force fire people!

Do I think Mr. Potato head or Dr Seuss or Little House in Prairie should cancel books and products ? HELL NO! But those are not Government decisions, they’re weak weak decisions, that at the end of the don’t affect my life!

So according to your rules of free speech, in the middle of a corporate board meeting, you can stand up and freely spew crap very little people agree with, racist, bigoted, political, left or right,,, stuff that had nothing to do with the company’s agenda... and if a corporation fires that person... it’s speech tyranny?

And by the way, I guess it’s okay with you that FOX and the Republicans have cancel cultured the senators and congressmen who voted to impeach or convict orange man. Even though they were expressing their free choice and speech.



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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-05 9:26 PM (#775874 - in reply to #775869)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Cap'nMess - 2021-03-05 9:09 PM

Fish - 2021-03-05 2:31 PM

I think that the term "Cancel Culture" has been applied pretty broadly, or narrowly, depending on who is delivering the message.

For me, the definition can be summed up as: a politically motivated group, organization or individual who seeks to use social pressure to isolate or neutralize the opinions of a group, organization, business or individual.

In the examples you give, I see in the first two examples, choices made by corporations as to what they think will be the least damaging to them on a bottom line. In the Amazon example, Parler running on Amazon was probably not widely known before Parler became a more prominent part of the conversation. When some of the content that was being shared and posted on Parler became known, and that it was being hosted on Amazon, then they had a choice...they could either deal with potential backlash from those who found the material objectionable, or the backlash from taking down a platform that many conservatives were now using for social media. They gave Parler the opportunity to deal with the objectionable material, and Parler declined to implement it, so Amazon made the decision to shut them off.

You could argue it was those who went crawling through Parler looking for the material were bent on shutting down the site, and they did everything they could do generate social pressure, which in turn influences Amazon's decision - and that would be Cancel Culture as I see it, but Amazon I don't see as part of that per se. If the pressure didn't exist, Parler would probably be still there.

On the Twitter example, I think that one is more related to the specific content. If you look at the timeline for that story, it was first brought to the Wall Street Journal, who after doing their own work, decided that the information wasn't credible enough to publish, and as such they didn't. The story then went to the New York Post, where the byline - that is to say who the story was credited to was Emma-Jo Morris a deputy politics editor who just joined the Post, and Gabrielle Fonrouge, who reportedly had little to do with the article. Bruce Golding who apparently did contribute to it, did not wish his byline to be used because he felt like much of it wasn't credible. If you also consider that Rudy Giulinani - Trump's personal attorney - is the one that brought it to the Post, and had a vested interest in causing damage to a political rival, then I think there's good reason to be cautious about it.

The challenge comes down to determining when something is untrue, and what sort of damage that might do to individuals, institutions or the nation. Libel and Slander laws are not sufficient, nor is the court system efficient enough to deal with these things. In history, you've seen where lies have been used to "cancel" or indeed kill people. The two best examples in US History would be the Salem witch trials, and the McCarthy era purges, where being accused of being a witch or a communist sympathizer basically tarnished, or even condemned that individual before they had a fair trial.

When faced with promoting something that is quite questionable, or very suspect, I think social media companies are faced with a challenge...when is it okay to publish these things, and when is it not. I think they've made plenty of mistakes trying to be too lenient and seen things like Qanon flare up, and so they've overreacted in some instances the other way.

I myself don't know what the answer is. I got interested in Qanon from a "where did it come from" and "what do followers believe" and was really quite amazed at how the whole thing operates. It's an alternate reality that seems like no regular person would believe in, but then again there are wide range of people that do indeed believe it.

When someone in the public eye or a leader gives credence to it, even tacitly, then that can have far ranging impact on those individuals as well as those who may be impacted by their actions.

Nazism and Fascism in some sense were similar more politically motivated incidents of this behavior, as is what has transgressed in places like Venezeula, where a small group uses those actions to manipulate the country as a whole to do things they otherwise wouldn't do.

I'm not for cancelling out voices, but I do have concern about those who tell lies and from positions of authority, and I think there will always be reactions to things that are socially questionable. Personally I'd like to see more voices heard, and I'd like it to be less about preventing and more about creating...but that's a pipe dream.

When a party like the Democratic party helps engineer Hillary Clinton's candidacy in 2016, or when Donald Trump threatens to crush all those who disagree with him, it makes people disaffected, and in some cases, can enable more extreme behavior.

For me Cancel Culture is part of a broader issue of attacking those you disagree with, and that is something that is far more prevalent than just liberal activists suppressing conservative voices.


I appreciate your view and opinion about this subject. I appreciate the fact that it appears that you think for yourself, and aren't swayed by a biased liberal media!


I guess you didn’t read what he wrote!

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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-05 9:31 PM (#775875 - in reply to #775868)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Cap'nMess - 2021-03-05 9:05 PM

PV29 - 2021-03-05 8:44 PM

By the way, it's refreshing to be able to debate these things without insults and ad hominen attacks. Cheers!




I completely agree.


This is old school, I remember the days on here when we debated this stuff all the time..I remember when Coach and I were roasted for supporting McCain.





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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-05 9:51 PM (#775876 - in reply to #775854)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Fish - 2021-03-05 2:31 PM

I think that the term "Cancel Culture" has been applied pretty broadly, or narrowly, depending on who is delivering the message.

For me, the definition can be summed up as: a politically motivated group, organization or individual who seeks to use social pressure to isolate or neutralize the opinions of a group, organization, business or individual.

In the examples you give, I see in the first two examples, choices made by corporations as to what they think will be the least damaging to them on a bottom line. In the Amazon example, Parler running on Amazon was probably not widely known before Parler became a more prominent part of the conversation. When some of the content that was being shared and posted on Parler became known, and that it was being hosted on Amazon, then they had a choice...they could either deal with potential backlash from those who found the material objectionable, or the backlash from taking down a platform that many conservatives were now using for social media. They gave Parler the opportunity to deal with the objectionable material, and Parler declined to implement it, so Amazon made the decision to shut them off.

You could argue it was those who went crawling through Parler looking for the material were bent on shutting down the site, and they did everything they could do generate social pressure, which in turn influences Amazon's decision - and that would be Cancel Culture as I see it, but Amazon I don't see as part of that per se. If the pressure didn't exist, Parler would probably be still there.

On the Twitter example, I think that one is more related to the specific content. If you look at the timeline for that story, it was first brought to the Wall Street Journal, who after doing their own work, decided that the information wasn't credible enough to publish, and as such they didn't. The story then went to the New York Post, where the byline - that is to say who the story was credited to was Emma-Jo Morris a deputy politics editor who just joined the Post, and Gabrielle Fonrouge, who reportedly had little to do with the article. Bruce Golding who apparently did contribute to it, did not wish his byline to be used because he felt like much of it wasn't credible. If you also consider that Rudy Giulinani - Trump's personal attorney - is the one that brought it to the Post, and had a vested interest in causing damage to a political rival, then I think there's good reason to be cautious about it.

The challenge comes down to determining when something is untrue, and what sort of damage that might do to individuals, institutions or the nation. Libel and Slander laws are not sufficient, nor is the court system efficient enough to deal with these things. In history, you've seen where lies have been used to "cancel" or indeed kill people. The two best examples in US History would be the Salem witch trials, and the McCarthy era purges, where being accused of being a witch or a communist sympathizer basically tarnished, or even condemned that individual before they had a fair trial.

When faced with promoting something that is quite questionable, or very suspect, I think social media companies are faced with a challenge...when is it okay to publish these things, and when is it not. I think they've made plenty of mistakes trying to be too lenient and seen things like Qanon flare up, and so they've overreacted in some instances the other way.

I myself don't know what the answer is. I got interested in Qanon from a "where did it come from" and "what do followers believe" and was really quite amazed at how the whole thing operates. It's an alternate reality that seems like no regular person would believe in, but then again there are wide range of people that do indeed believe it.

When someone in the public eye or a leader gives credence to it, even tacitly, then that can have far ranging impact on those individuals as well as those who may be impacted by their actions.

Nazism and Fascism in some sense were similar more politically motivated incidents of this behavior, as is what has transgressed in places like Venezeula, where a small group uses those actions to manipulate the country as a whole to do things they otherwise wouldn't do.

I'm not for cancelling out voices, but I do have concern about those who tell lies and from positions of authority, and I think there will always be reactions to things that are socially questionable. Personally I'd like to see more voices heard, and I'd like it to be less about preventing and more about creating...but that's a pipe dream.

When a party like the Democratic party helps engineer Hillary Clinton's candidacy in 2016, or when Donald Trump threatens to crush all those who disagree with him, it makes people disaffected, and in some cases, can enable more extreme behavior.

For me Cancel Culture is part of a broader issue of attacking those you disagree with, and that is something that is far more prevalent than just liberal activists suppressing conservative voices.


I don’t think it’s that tough to understand... money, the stock market, profit, brand pride, tv commercials, advertisers...etc etc etc is the dividing line of what’s politically correct... again, Chris Matthews, a big liberal, 30 years MSNBC highly decorated broadcaster .. FIRED .... Canceled in one night for using a bad analogy about the Holocaust that offended Bernie Sanders... Al Franken major liberal Senator, on a military comedy tour in the Middle East. with a military comedian woman.. she fell asleep on the plane, and he pretended to grab her breast.... Canceled. Mean while there’s photos of her roasting him, while he feel asleep.

My point of this thread is, this is nothing new. But since Trump, who is openly old Archie Bunker, bigot, racist, fascist, sexist who stirred the pot like a third world country dictator, has made it appear it’s okay for everyone else to be outwardly disgusting. But it’s not okay, to be these things at work, you’re free to say anything you want, but, again there’s a reason why the KKK wore hoods!







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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 6:37 AM (#775878 - in reply to #775875)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-05 11:31 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-05 9:05 PM

PV29 - 2021-03-05 8:44 PM

By the way, it's refreshing to be able to debate these things without insults and ad hominen attacks. Cheers!




I completely agree.


This is old school, I remember the days on here when we debated this stuff all the time..I remember when Coach and I were roasted for supporting McCain.









Being roasted for supporting a candidate is one thing, but you started this thread and basically called anyone who disagrees with it part of the KKK.

Stay classy, stay woke!



Edited by Cap'nMess 2021-03-06 6:44 AM
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 7:00 AM (#775879 - in reply to #775873)
Subject: Re: Cancel Cult





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Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-05 11:17 PM

PV29 - 2021-03-05 1:13 PM

So according to what I'm reading at the top, injustices and violations of rights occurring now are ok because there were injustices and violations of rights in the past. Wow.

Not only is that take twisted and inconsistent with a civilized society, it's factually incorrect.

The cancel culture we see now has nothing to do with race, gender or other identity group. It's about speech and thought that doesn't comply with the "acceptable" narrative of Leftist corporate media, Hollywood and big tech. If you question the election results by pointing out statistical anomalies or unconstitutional rule changes in certain states you get kicked off of social media, fired from your job and targeted by Leftists in Congress. Example: letter sent by two House members to cable/satellite TV providers questioning why they are still carrying Fox, OANN and Newsmax. That had nothing to do with race or gender, and everything to do with thought and free expression of ideas.

Why did Amazon, in coordination with Google and Apple, attack and de-platform a social media company (Parler)?
Why did Twitter ban the NY Post for reporting on Hunter Biden?
Why was a soccer player (Seth Jahn) removed from the U.S. Soccer Federation’s Athlete Council for expressing an opinion about standing for the anthem?

Cancel culture is thought and speech tyranny. Leftists have learned that the 1st Amendment only prohibits government action which infringes free speech. And they're using private companies to accomplish what they can't do through government action.



That’s funny, Democrats have been canceled also... Chris Matthews on MSNBC, cancelled for saying something not politically correct, Bill Mahr was cancelled, Al Franken cancelled... Tiki Barber Canceled... Colin Kaepernick, canceled! ... over the last 20 years 100’s of people in politics and the entertainment world have been cancelled for saying stupid crap... do I agree with it no! But to pretend it’s anything new and to victimize yourself is a freakin joke... there’s a list of tens of thousands of people since the 1920s that have been fired for saying politically incorrect stuff as politicians or entertainers! Give me a Republican or white person being fired-or cancelled and I can give you a lefty who has been also. So stop with this victimization crap already! Disconnect from the FOX radicalization.

Speech Tyranny? LOL! Who’s been arrested ? Advertisers force fire people!

Do I think Mr. Potato head or Dr Seuss or Little House in Prairie should cancel books and products ? HELL NO! But those are not Government decisions, they’re weak weak decisions, that at the end of the don’t affect my life!

So according to your rules of free speech, in the middle of a corporate board meeting, you can stand up and freely spew crap very little people agree with, racist, bigoted, political, left or right,,, stuff that had nothing to do with the company’s agenda... and if a corporation fires that person... it’s speech tyranny?

And by the way, I guess it’s okay with you that FOX and the Republicans have cancel cultured the senators and congressmen who voted to impeach or convict orange man. Even though they were expressing their free choice and speech.





I agree the first few people you mentioned were cancelled, although I think Franken was accused of sexual harassment which is a completely different thing, like if the accusations are true against Cuomo he should resign. I agree both sides lie against each other and try to cancel one another, but now compared to 20 years ago, it is INSANE!

You are absolutely correct about Dr Seuss Mr Potato Head and so on, but what's going to be next?

Lets not make it a Dem, Rep, or Ind thing, let's agree together that we live in a FREE country (FOR NOW) and keep our rights. We should not be force fed what to think or not to think, say or what not to say. Whether you're the wackiest liberal or the most up tight conservative.
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 7:12 AM (#775880 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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Actually Matthews was let go because of saying something inappropriate to a guest, not political.

Maher who is as liberal as they come, says cancel culture is real and insane and needs to stop, he also told liberals to wake up.

Kaepernick was given the chance at a tryout for a team and didn't show up.
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Fish
Posted 2021-03-06 8:18 AM (#775881 - in reply to #775866)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture



Publisher

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PV29 - 2021-03-05 5:44 PM

By the way, it's refreshing to be able to debate these things without insults and ad hominen attacks. Cheers!


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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 8:21 AM (#775882 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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Just one more thing, well maybe one more.....

You said it's advertisers that cancel, well Hillary, AOC and others (politicians) Katie Couric, Whoopie, Joy blowhard (Media) have stated that Trump supporters need to be "reprogrammed". Some Dems, including AOC have stated that anyone who worked for Trump should never be employed again. AOC has also said that there should be "lists" of all Trump supporters. That is a lot more than just advertisers!

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PV29
Posted 2021-03-06 8:23 AM (#775883 - in reply to #775873)
Subject: Re: Cancel Cult





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Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-05 11:17 PMThat’s funny, Democrats have been canceled also... Chris Matthews on MSNBC, cancelled for saying something not politically correct, Bill Mahr was cancelled, Al Franken cancelled... Tiki Barber Canceled... Colin Kaepernick, canceled! ... over the last 20 years 100’s of people in politics and the entertainment world have been cancelled for saying stupid crap... do I agree with it no! But to pretend it’s anything new and to victimize yourself is a freakin joke... there’s a list of tens of thousands of people since the 1920s that have been fired for saying politically incorrect stuff as politicians or entertainers! Give me a Republican or white person being fired-or cancelled and I can give you a lefty who has been also. So stop with this victimization crap already! Disconnect from the FOX radicalization. Speech Tyranny? LOL! Who’s been arrested ? Advertisers force fire people! Do I think Mr. Potato head or Dr Seuss or Little House in Prairie should cancel books and products ? HELL NO! But those are not Government decisions, they’re weak weak decisions, that at the end of the don’t affect my life! So according to your rules of free speech, in the middle of a corporate board meeting, you can stand up and freely spew crap very little people agree with, racist, bigoted, political, left or right,,, stuff that had nothing to do with the company’s agenda... and if a corporation fires that person... it’s speech tyranny? And by the way, I guess it’s okay with you that FOX and the Republicans have cancel cultured the senators and congressmen who voted to impeach or convict orange man. Even though they were expressing their free choice and speech.

 

I think you're equating an employers right to fire an employee with the targeting of businesses and persons by bigtech for expressing political ideas.  They are not the same.

Of course an employee can't yell racist or insensitive things without repercussions.  That's NOT cancel culture.  You're not seeing the distinction and, honestly, I'm probably not explaining it as clearly as I should.  Some examples:  Amazon is censoring books because they disagree with the ideas of the authors.  YouTube takes down Trump's CPAC speech because they oppose his politics.  Goya gets boycotted because the CEO went to the White House for a meeting with Trump.  MyPillow gets cancelled by BedBath& Beyond and Target because the owner says he has evidence of voter fraud,  Statues of Lincoln, Washington, Jefferson, and Grant (none of them Confederates, two of which fought the Confederacy) must be taken down because of some perceived offense (Washington and Jefferson "owned" slaves, but also forged a nation that saw slavery abolished in the North shortly thereafter and then in the South after a bloody Civil War).

Just because people haven't been "arrested" doesn't mean that there isn't tyranny.  Taking away someone's business, destroying their career and their livelihood is also a form of tyranny.  It is a "taking" without due process that constitutes tyranny if the government did it.  That is the issue now.  Private actors are carrying out the persecution of political rivals on behalf of Leftists in government and corporatist cronies (Amazon, Google, Apple).

Republicans are not "canceling" the members of Congress who voted to impeach Trump.  Those people still have their jobs and nobody is censoring them.  They're gonna get primaried in '22 though.  That's called politics.

Kapernick canceled himself when he walked out on his contract with the 49ers.

Last point:  China has decreed (through their corrupt court system) that homosexuality is a "mental disorder".  How come the NBA, Apple, WalMart, and all the big corps that do billions of dollars of business with China are not screaming about this and pulling their business out of China?  Well, obviously it's because of money.  Cancel culture is not only tyrannical, it's also hypocritical.

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PV29
Posted 2021-03-06 8:26 AM (#775885 - in reply to #775879)
Subject: Re: Cancel Cult





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Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 9:00 AM  I agree the first few people you mentioned were cancelled, although I think Franken was accused of sexual harassment which is a completely different thing, like if the accusations are true against Cuomo he should resign. I agree both sides lie against each other and try to cancel one another, but now compared to 20 years ago, it is INSANE! You are absolutely correct about Dr Seuss Mr Potato Head and so on, but what's going to be next? Lets not make it a Dem, Rep, or Ind thing, let's agree together that we live in a FREE country (FOR NOW) and keep our rights. We should not be force fed what to think or not to think, say or what not to say. Whether you're the wackiest liberal or the most up tight conservative.

 

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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-06 8:36 AM (#775886 - in reply to #775878)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 8:37 AM

Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-05 11:31 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-05 9:05 PM

PV29 - 2021-03-05 8:44 PM

By the way, it's refreshing to be able to debate these things without insults and ad hominen attacks. Cheers!




I completely agree.


This is old school, I remember the days on here when we debated this stuff all the time..I remember when Coach and I were roasted for supporting McCain.









Being roasted for supporting a candidate is one thing, but you started this thread and basically called anyone who disagrees with it part of the KKK.

Stay classy, stay woke!



Sorry that wasn’t my intention.... I just wanted to point out the cancel culture has been around forever, and that people had freedom of speech, know ones been arrested.. being fired from your job for saying things that offend others whether political, racist, sexist, is up to the employer.

The heart of the Cancel Culture in the entertainment- media-professional athletes and Politicians come down to our true masters... The advertisers and tv commercials that pays everyone salaries... they decide and force fire people they think will harm their Brand, hurt their profit.

And there was a reason why the KKK wore hoods!

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PV29
Posted 2021-03-06 8:39 AM (#775887 - in reply to #775876)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-05 11:51 PM  I don’t think it’s that tough to understand... money, the stock market, profit, brand pride, tv commercials, advertisers...etc etc etc is the dividing line of what’s politically correct... again, Chris Matthews, a big liberal, 30 years MSNBC highly decorated broadcaster .. FIRED .... Canceled in one night for using a bad analogy about the Holocaust that offended Bernie Sanders... Al Franken major liberal Senator, on a military comedy tour in the Middle East. with a military comedian woman.. she fell asleep on the plane, and he pretended to grab her breast.... Canceled. Mean while there’s photos of her roasting him, while he feel asleep. My point of this thread is, this is nothing new. But since Trump, who is openly old Archie Bunker, bigot, racist, fascist, sexist who stirred the pot like a third world country dictator, has made it appear it’s okay for everyone else to be outwardly disgusting. But it’s not okay, to be these things at work, you’re free to say anything you want, but, again there’s a reason why the KKK wore hoods!

 

I kinda understand how Trump's style is too coarse for some, but I have no clue why people insist that he's racist, bigoted or a fascist.

What has he done that proves that he's a racist?  I see him creating Opportunity Zones in minority neighborhoods.  I see him giving Historically Black Colleges & Universities more money than they evver had and for a longer term than even Obama gave them.  I see minority uneployment pre-COVID being the lowest ever in history.  I see criminal justice reform finally being passed that corrected the unfair treatment of blacks in the criminal justice system.  I see him fighting for charter schools and school choice that benefits parent in primarily minority school dstricts because the public schools suck and they can't afford to send their kids to Sidwell Friends like Obama did.  I see people like Herschel Walker and Alveda King saying that he's a champion for the economic and educational advancement of minorities, moreso than any Democrat whose empty promises have done nothing to help minorities. 

What has he done to prove that he's a fascist?  Did he sign 60+ EO's in his first week in office?  Did he take over private businesses, or enact federal mandates that violated states' rights?  Did he build a razor-wire wall around the Capitol and place thousands of troops to defend it?  Where exactly is the fascism?

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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-06 8:56 AM (#775890 - in reply to #775885)
Subject: Re: Cancel Cult





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
PV29 - 2021-03-06 10:26 AM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 9:00 AM  I agree the first few people you mentioned were cancelled, although I think Franken was accused of sexual harassment which is a completely different thing, like if the accusations are true against Cuomo he should resign. I agree both sides lie against each other and try to cancel one another, but now compared to 20 years ago, it is INSANE! You are absolutely correct about Dr Seuss Mr Potato Head and so on, but what's going to be next? Lets not make it a Dem, Rep, or Ind thing, let's agree together that we live in a FREE country (FOR NOW) and keep our rights. We should not be force fed what to think or not to think, say or what not to say. Whether you're the wackiest liberal or the most up tight conservative.

 





Laura Ingalls Wilder books Little House in the prairie, have been scrubbed from libraries, banned from schools and book stores over concerns about her depiction of other races! Mainly about American Indians...Views that people had 120 years ago... she grew up on the prairie and the Indians were boggy men in the shadows back then... this disturbs me, I can see if people had these views now, but scrubbing these books is censoring history, taking away the understanding of the past... aren’t we developed enough to understand, this was how people thought then?

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PV29
Posted 2021-03-06 9:06 AM (#775894 - in reply to #775890)
Subject: Re: Cancel Cult





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1000

Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-06 10:56 AM  Laura Ingalls Wilder books Little House in the prairie, have been scrubbed from libraries, banned from schools and book stores over concerns about her depiction of other races! Mainly about American Indians...Views that people had 120 years ago... she grew up on the prairie and the Indians were boggy men in the shadows back then... this disturbs me, I can see if people had these views now, but scrubbing these books is censoring history, taking away the understanding of the past... aren’t we developed enough to understand, this was how people thought then?

 

It's about power.  The people who cause this type of whitewashing of history do it because it makes them feel powerful.  There is no valid educational or cultural reason for this. 

I read Huck Finn as a young lad.  It was taught to me that the deragatory words and depictions used to describe black people and Native Americans as portrayed in the book were commonplace back then but had no place in current society.  I was taught CONTEXT, and crtical thinking.  Two principles that apparently threaten certain segments of our society becuase they equip people with the vision to see through the bullshit.



Edited by PV29 2021-03-06 9:08 AM
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 11:42 AM (#775917 - in reply to #775887)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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1000
PV29 - 2021-03-06 10:39 AM

Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-05 11:51 PM  I don’t think it’s that tough to understand... money, the stock market, profit, brand pride, tv commercials, advertisers...etc etc etc is the dividing line of what’s politically correct... again, Chris Matthews, a big liberal, 30 years MSNBC highly decorated broadcaster .. FIRED .... Canceled in one night for using a bad analogy about the Holocaust that offended Bernie Sanders... Al Franken major liberal Senator, on a military comedy tour in the Middle East. with a military comedian woman.. she fell asleep on the plane, and he pretended to grab her breast.... Canceled. Mean while there’s photos of her roasting him, while he feel asleep. My point of this thread is, this is nothing new. But since Trump, who is openly old Archie Bunker, bigot, racist, fascist, sexist who stirred the pot like a third world country dictator, has made it appear it’s okay for everyone else to be outwardly disgusting. But it’s not okay, to be these things at work, you’re free to say anything you want, but, again there’s a reason why the KKK wore hoods!

 

I kinda understand how Trump's style is too coarse for some, but I have no clue why people insist that he's racist, bigoted or a fascist.

What has he done that proves that he's a racist?  I see him creating Opportunity Zones in minority neighborhoods.  I see him giving Historically Black Colleges & Universities more money than they evver had and for a longer term than even Obama gave them.  I see minority uneployment pre-COVID being the lowest ever in history.  I see criminal justice reform finally being passed that corrected the unfair treatment of blacks in the criminal justice system.  I see him fighting for charter schools and school choice that benefits parent in primarily minority school dstricts because the public schools suck and they can't afford to send their kids to Sidwell Friends like Obama did.  I see people like Herschel Walker and Alveda King saying that he's a champion for the economic and educational advancement of minorities, moreso than any Democrat whose empty promises have done nothing to help minorities. 

What has he done to prove that he's a fascist?  Did he sign 60+ EO's in his first week in office?  Did he take over private businesses, or enact federal mandates that violated states' rights?  Did he build a razor-wire wall around the Capitol and place thousands of troops to defend it?  Where exactly is the fascism?



MIC DROP!!!
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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-06 11:51 AM (#775923 - in reply to #775887)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
PV29 - 2021-03-06 10:39 AM

Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-05 11:51 PM  I don’t think it’s that tough to understand... money, the stock market, profit, brand pride, tv commercials, advertisers...etc etc etc is the dividing line of what’s politically correct... again, Chris Matthews, a big liberal, 30 years MSNBC highly decorated broadcaster .. FIRED .... Canceled in one night for using a bad analogy about the Holocaust that offended Bernie Sanders... Al Franken major liberal Senator, on a military comedy tour in the Middle East. with a military comedian woman.. she fell asleep on the plane, and he pretended to grab her breast.... Canceled. Mean while there’s photos of her roasting him, while he feel asleep. My point of this thread is, this is nothing new. But since Trump, who is openly old Archie Bunker, bigot, racist, fascist, sexist who stirred the pot like a third world country dictator, has made it appear it’s okay for everyone else to be outwardly disgusting. But it’s not okay, to be these things at work, you’re free to say anything you want, but, again there’s a reason why the KKK wore hoods!

 

I kinda understand how Trump's style is too coarse for some, but I have no clue why people insist that he's racist, bigoted or a fascist.

What has he done that proves that he's a racist?  I see him creating Opportunity Zones in minority neighborhoods.  I see him giving Historically Black Colleges & Universities more money than they evver had and for a longer term than even Obama gave them.  I see minority uneployment pre-COVID being the lowest ever in history.  I see criminal justice reform finally being passed that corrected the unfair treatment of blacks in the criminal justice system.  I see him fighting for charter schools and school choice that benefits parent in primarily minority school dstricts because the public schools suck and they can't afford to send their kids to Sidwell Friends like Obama did.  I see people like Herschel Walker and Alveda King saying that he's a champion for the economic and educational advancement of minorities, moreso than any Democrat whose empty promises have done nothing to help minorities. 

What has he done to prove that he's a fascist?  Did he sign 60+ EO's in his first week in office?  Did he take over private businesses, or enact federal mandates that violated states' rights?  Did he build a razor-wire wall around the Capitol and place thousands of troops to defend it?  Where exactly is the fascism?



I think Trump is several things, one, he’s an old school rich Archie Bunker, who doesn’t realize what he says is bigotry or racist or sexist... his social mentality is stuck in the 60s and 70s... Two, he panders to one side, and one race alienating the others.

These things below are fact, recorded out of the mouth of Trump, mostly unreported by the right wing news.

He attacked Muslim Gold Star Parents

He claimed a Judge was biased because “ he was Mexican”.

The justice Dept sued his company - twice - for not renting to black people. In fact, discrimination against black people has been a pattern in his career. He’s on recorded record by saying “you don’t want to live with them neither”.

He refused to condemn the white supremacist who are campaigning for him. David Duke and dozens of racist, kkk, white power groups openly support him.

He started the whole thing about Obama not being American.

Right out of Hitlers book “mein kampf” Trump made himself and his race, victims, he made people feel sorry for him because the Jew - Black driven left were out to get him, then said, I’m trying to protect you, I guess they hate you too. Exactly what Hitler did in his book, then he made it a Nationalism cry of MAGA by saying Mexicans were the reasons for the problems in their lives... Like Hitler did with the Jews.

He completely went after and “canceled cultured” black NFL players for kneeling during the nation anthem. At a rally he called black NFL players “sons of bitches”... in other words he called their mothers bitches! Sons of bitches is considered, in the black community as a racist remark.... Black mothers are the corner stone of the black family, mostly as single mothers....Every black Church in America made this point known, Trump calling black mothers bitches.

He called BLM a terrorist group, but didn’t say the same about Nazi-white Supremest groups.

He treats racial groups as monoliths... “I have black friends so I’m not racist!

He cordoned the beating of a Black Lives Matter protestor

He called white supporters who beat on a homeless Latino Man “passionate”

He stereotyped Jews and shared anti-Semitic views shared by Hitler and White Supremacists.

He treats African - Americans as tokens to dispel the idea he’s a racist.

He calls a group of Americans, who are Anti Fascist- politically partisan, multi nationality and all religions, that show up only to oppose Nazi - white Supremest marches... Terrorist! Then calls the White Supremest “ good people”.

About African immigrants , Trump said “Africa was a bunch of shithole nations, why can’t we have more immigrants from (white) Norway.”The next day the president put an ad in the Times listing why Norwegians, and many other European countries aren’t coming to America anymore! Guns, income equality, poor education, the evangelical cult... etc etc etc...

He said all Mexicans are rapist and thieves,,, and very few are good ones.

'These aren’t people. These are animals.' When referring to Latinos on the border.

Dozens of white - Nazi Supremest Militia groups stormed the Capital on his behalf .. When you’re charging the Capital and the person too the left and right of you believe all Jews and people of color should die, you have a problem. That’s why there’s wired fencing, because racist groups and QAnon tried to over throw the Government making Trump a fascist.

The list goes on and on and on, and you can try to defined it or deny it, or say it’s fake news, or taken out of context... but people aren’t stupid, when it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck.... ! There’s a reason why 96% of “Other” non white people voted against Trump, only 4% voted for him. And all the people that voted against (10 million voted independent) are socialist, CNN zombies.

. I want a Republican Party, but they don’t want me, the candidates that I support or supported are to moderate, aren’t evangelical cult members, FOX Nazis. The fear of socialism has backed The GOP supporters into fascism and nationalism. I’m right in the middle, with the constitution. ...worried the communist to the left and Fascist to the right might win... what every swings hard to the right, swings even further to the left...



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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 12:07 PM (#775929 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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1000
WOW!!

I know you don't really believe these "facts"....NO WAY

Just for one he NEVER said "black players" NEVER! He said any player that kneels is a SOB, there were white kneelers also!! Just one more, he denounced white supremacy groups multiple times.

sleepy joe has said blacks are super predators. He's not racist. sleepy joe has said you can't find a DD that's not owned by someone from India, he's not racist. He said Obumma is a well spoken black guy, it's a fairytale man, he's not a racist. He has said more racist things that Trump ever did. You aint black if you don't for me, are you on cocaine?

You hate Trump so he's a racist, you probably voted or like joe so he isn't Got it
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PV29
Posted 2021-03-06 12:15 PM (#775937 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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The "fine people" hoax was debunked during the impeachment trial. The full statement without edits and cuts was played by Trump's lawyers and millions saw it for the first time. Please stop perpetuating that lie.

He doesn't back down when Leftists call him "racist". The gold star father was a prop during the 2015-16 election and Trump called him out for his statements, NOT for his ethnicity.

He never said that all Mexicans are rapists, etc. He said that there are bad people among those who are crossing the border illegally. The twisting of his statements by a diabolical Leftist media is ridiculous.

He called people "animals" based on their ACTIONS, not their ethnicity. The things that the cartels and the human traffickers do definitely qualifies them as animals.

His daughter is married to a Jewish guy, his grandkids are being raised orthodox Jewish, he moved the US embassy to Jerusalem and he prayed at the wailing wall with a yarmulke on. How the hell is that antisemitic or bigoted? Again, I think the hatred for the man blinds people to reality, combined with a hostile corporate media that takes issue with everything he says or does. Democrats presented false and altered evidence during the last impeachment trial, what makes anyone think that they won't lie in the media.

Trump is a threat to the status quo. The globalists and the elites that want total power and wealth while you and I struggle for the crumbs they leave behind. Pre-COVID the middle class, of all races, did much better under Trump than any other president since Reagan. The wealth gap was reduced and the elites/globalists of Wall Street and Silicone Valley hated him for that. They brand him "racist" and "bigot" because that's all they have. Trump eroded the voting base of Democrats in the black and Latino community. That is a fact. David Shor wrote recently in New Yorker Mag about this. He's not exactly conservative and the New Yorker ain't Breitbart.

"White voters as a whole trended toward the Democratic Party, and nonwhite voters trended away from us. So we’re now somewhere between 2004 and 2008 in terms of racial polarization. Which is interesting. I don’t think a lot of people expected Donald Trump’s GOP to have a much more diverse support base than Mitt Romney’s did in 2012. But that’s what happened."

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/03/david-shor-2020-democrats-au...

People eventually get to the truth. Democrats have taken working class minorities for granted for decades. They're finding Trump's policies and the fact that he does what he says he'll do much more appealing. If Trump was a racist then why are minorities supporting him more than they've ever supported a Republican before?
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 12:21 PM (#775940 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 1:22 PM (#775982 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





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1000
PV29 2024!!
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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-06 1:23 PM (#775983 - in reply to #775940)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 2:21 PM

He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.


He’s been called a racist his whole life.


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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-06 3:17 PM (#775994 - in reply to #775983)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-06 3:23 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 2:21 PM

He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.


He’s been called a racist his whole life.




I'm guessing that's another "fact"......Ok
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PV29
Posted 2021-03-06 5:59 PM (#776001 - in reply to #775940)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 2326
1000

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 2:21 PM He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.

 

Before 2015 he was invited to functions with Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Clintons, etc.  Were they inviting a known racist?  Did Trump suddenly become a racist in 2015?

So ridiculous.

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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-06 9:25 PM (#776005 - in reply to #776001)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
PV29 - 2021-03-06 7:59 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 2:21 PM He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.

 

Before 2015 he was invited to functions with Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Clintons, etc.  Were they inviting a known racist?  Did Trump suddenly become a racist in 2015?

So ridiculous.



He and his father have been racist slumlords for decades.... look at all the racist lawsuits against them since the 60s, 70s and 8os .... who gives a crap about his corrupt outings with lowlife liberals! ... like you lot said, he rubbed elbows with the libs for profit! I can’t believe you guys have such a hardon for a complete scam artist.




Edited by Andy Bathgate 2021-03-06 9:27 PM
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-07 1:01 PM (#776014 - in reply to #776005)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-06 11:25 PM

PV29 - 2021-03-06 7:59 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 2:21 PM He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.

 

Before 2015 he was invited to functions with Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Clintons, etc.  Were they inviting a known racist?  Did Trump suddenly become a racist in 2015?

So ridiculous.



He and his father have been racist slumlords for decades.... look at all the racist lawsuits against them since the 60s, 70s and 8os .... who gives a crap about his corrupt outings with lowlife liberals! ... like you lot said, he rubbed elbows with the libs for profit! I can’t believe you guys have such a hardon for a complete scam artist.




Blah blah blah

You are blinded by hate, or you just believe what you're told like all sheep..

You probably preach tolerance and yet you're probably the most intolerant person here, just like all liberals...

I kinda feel bad for you, but I believe you will realize the truth someday.
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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-08 11:14 AM (#776164 - in reply to #776014)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Cap'nMess - 2021-03-07 3:01 PM

Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-06 11:25 PM

PV29 - 2021-03-06 7:59 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 2:21 PM He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.

 

Before 2015 he was invited to functions with Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Clintons, etc.  Were they inviting a known racist?  Did Trump suddenly become a racist in 2015?

So ridiculous.



He and his father have been racist slumlords for decades.... look at all the racist lawsuits against them since the 60s, 70s and 8os .... who gives a crap about his corrupt outings with lowlife liberals! ... like you lot said, he rubbed elbows with the libs for profit! I can’t believe you guys have such a hardon for a complete scam artist.




Blah blah blah

You are blinded by hate, or you just believe what you're told like all sheep..

You probably preach tolerance and yet you're probably the most intolerant person here, just like all liberals...

I kinda feel bad for you, but I believe you will realize the truth someday.


Typical response from a poorly informed FOX - Hannity zombie, when you have nothing intelligent to say, you get aggressive and personal, do you also feel bad for close to 90 million American independent and Liberal voters that agree with me? Will we all realize the truth one day? Hope you’re not putting money on that!

Look at the key States Trump lost, look how much he lost by, then look at the Independent (moderate) vote, we decided the results! We gave him a chanced, he sucked! CANCELED!!! And yes do, please start a new party!

While you feel bad for me, pray for me also! I have tons of those coming from my evangelical family cult members!



LGR!
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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-08 11:28 AM (#776165 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
Saying you're blinded by hate, or just believe whatever you're told is aggressive ???

Now I can understand your irrational thinking a little more, you simply don't have a clue.

Still feeling sorry for you.

But LGR I agree!

Edited by Cap'nMess 2021-03-08 11:28 AM
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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-08 12:49 PM (#776168 - in reply to #776165)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Cap'nMess - 2021-03-08 1:28 PM

Saying you're blinded by hate, or just believe whatever you're told is aggressive ???

Now I can understand your irrational thinking a little more, you simply don't have a clue.

Still feeling sorry for you.

But LGR I agree!


Yeah! The 90 million plus - clueless club, please pray for us also




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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-03-08 2:13 PM (#776169 - in reply to #776168)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-08 2:49 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-08 1:28 PM

Saying you're blinded by hate, or just believe whatever you're told is aggressive ???

Now I can understand your irrational thinking a little more, you simply don't have a clue.

Still feeling sorry for you.

But LGR I agree!


Yeah! The 90 million plus - clueless club, please pray for us also








Cry for help heard!
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Andy Bathgate
Posted 2021-03-08 4:16 PM (#776170 - in reply to #776169)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1017
1000
Location: NYC & Charlotte, NC
Cap'nMess - 2021-03-08 4:13 PM

Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-08 2:49 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-08 1:28 PM

Saying you're blinded by hate, or just believe whatever you're told is aggressive ???

Now I can understand your irrational thinking a little more, you simply don't have a clue.

Still feeling sorry for you.

But LGR I agree!


Yeah! The 90 million plus - clueless club, please pray for us also








Cry for help heard!


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Blue404
Posted 2021-05-07 10:44 AM (#779562 - in reply to #775289)
Subject: RE: Cancel Culture




Posts: 3835
2500
Location: USA

Be less white

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Cap'nMess
Posted 2021-11-04 2:53 PM (#782414 - in reply to #776164)
Subject: Re: Cancel Culture





Posts: 1619
1000
Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-08 2:14 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-07 3:01 PM

Andy Bathgate - 2021-03-06 11:25 PM

PV29 - 2021-03-06 7:59 PM

Cap'nMess - 2021-03-06 2:21 PM He has been in the limelight for years and no one ever accused him of being a racist until he became the republican nominee.

 

Before 2015 he was invited to functions with Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, the Clintons, etc.  Were they inviting a known racist?  Did Trump suddenly become a racist in 2015?

So ridiculous.



He and his father have been racist slumlords for decades.... look at all the racist lawsuits against them since the 60s, 70s and 8os .... who gives a crap about his corrupt outings with lowlife liberals! ... like you lot said, he rubbed elbows with the libs for profit! I can’t believe you guys have such a hardon for a complete scam artist.




Blah blah blah

You are blinded by hate, or you just believe what you're told like all sheep..

You probably preach tolerance and yet you're probably the most intolerant person here, just like all liberals...

I kinda feel bad for you, but I believe you will realize the truth someday.


Typical response from a poorly informed FOX - Hannity zombie, when you have nothing intelligent to say, you get aggressive and personal, do you also feel bad for close to 90 million American independent and Liberal voters that agree with me? Will we all realize the truth one day? Hope you’re not putting money on that!

Look at the key States Trump lost, look how much he lost by, then look at the Independent (moderate) vote, we decided the results! We gave him a chanced, he sucked! CANCELED!!! And yes do, please start a new party!

While you feel bad for me, pray for me also! I have tons of those coming from my evangelical family cult members!



LGR!


I'm betting you wish this wasn't in print.. I've read 35 million + have extreme buyers remorse, I'm sure you're one of them.

You should delete this thread
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